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	<title>Comments on: Speaking of LDS Scouting&#8230;</title>
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	<link>http://livingwithmormons.com/speaking-of-lds-scouts/</link>
	<description>Collisions between faith and reason in Utah</description>
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		<title>By: admin</title>
		<link>http://livingwithmormons.com/speaking-of-lds-scouts/comment-page-1/#comment-600</link>
		<dc:creator>admin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Sep 2010 16:55:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://livingwithmormons.com/?p=159#comment-600</guid>
		<description>Hi Beetle,

My oldest is 7 now and I&#039;ve struggled with the idea as well.  You didn&#039;t say if you lived in Utah, but I think the religious influence in Scouts is greater here than most other states.
In principle, I have a hard time associating with an organization that holds such clear discrimination rules, but I admit there are a lot of good experiences in Scouts.
Good luck and keep us posted.

Cheers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Beetle,</p>
<p>My oldest is 7 now and I&#8217;ve struggled with the idea as well.  You didn&#8217;t say if you lived in Utah, but I think the religious influence in Scouts is greater here than most other states.<br />
In principle, I have a hard time associating with an organization that holds such clear discrimination rules, but I admit there are a lot of good experiences in Scouts.<br />
Good luck and keep us posted.</p>
<p>Cheers.</p>
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		<title>By: Beetle</title>
		<link>http://livingwithmormons.com/speaking-of-lds-scouts/comment-page-1/#comment-599</link>
		<dc:creator>Beetle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Sep 2010 16:47:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://livingwithmormons.com/?p=159#comment-599</guid>
		<description>Thanks for this.  I just signed my 7 year old up for Cub Scouts, and feel like a hypocrite, but the good outweighs the bad.  Please be encouraged to post resources on pushing back on homophobia from within the BSA system.  Thanks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for this.  I just signed my 7 year old up for Cub Scouts, and feel like a hypocrite, but the good outweighs the bad.  Please be encouraged to post resources on pushing back on homophobia from within the BSA system.  Thanks!</p>
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		<title>By: Richard</title>
		<link>http://livingwithmormons.com/speaking-of-lds-scouts/comment-page-1/#comment-414</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 23 Mar 2010 23:56:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://livingwithmormons.com/?p=159#comment-414</guid>
		<description>Im a Scout Leader in the UK, with the UK Scout association, and although the stuff on youth members and religion posted above is correct, the UK Scout association does have this in its Policy, Organisation and Rules &quot;Note: With reference to religious belief, the avowed absence of religious belief is a bar to appointment to a Leadership position.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Im a Scout Leader in the UK, with the UK Scout association, and although the stuff on youth members and religion posted above is correct, the UK Scout association does have this in its Policy, Organisation and Rules &#8220;Note: With reference to religious belief, the avowed absence of religious belief is a bar to appointment to a Leadership position.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Sick and Tired</title>
		<link>http://livingwithmormons.com/speaking-of-lds-scouts/comment-page-1/#comment-341</link>
		<dc:creator>Sick and Tired</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 14:17:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://livingwithmormons.com/?p=159#comment-341</guid>
		<description>Again people and organizations are being berated and punished for believing in something and taking a a stand and establishing standards to protect and teach their common beliefs to those who concur. I am tired of being convicted of being uncaring, non-christian, having a lack of compassion, archaic, non progressive, etc. I find it saddly hilarious that what was good moral behavior in the old days is no longer correct today. I find it sad that as society changes their opinion of what is good moral behavior, then those who hold fast to what they believe, including organizations, to be correct are beaten down and sought out to be mocked and broken. It seems it has become sport to muddy those who believe in a higher standard of morality. Its not discrimination to require others who want to participate in their organization to uphold certain standards. More energy is spent trying to break the BSA because of its standard, than to create your own organization that would serve your standards. It is a guarentee that no matter what I write to defend the honor of the BSA, there will be 10 times the effort to break the BSA. If you the scout or leader cannot stand and recite the scout oath and law and truly try to live your lives by them because you disagree with what you are saying, then find somwhere else to participate that agrees with your beliefs.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Again people and organizations are being berated and punished for believing in something and taking a a stand and establishing standards to protect and teach their common beliefs to those who concur. I am tired of being convicted of being uncaring, non-christian, having a lack of compassion, archaic, non progressive, etc. I find it saddly hilarious that what was good moral behavior in the old days is no longer correct today. I find it sad that as society changes their opinion of what is good moral behavior, then those who hold fast to what they believe, including organizations, to be correct are beaten down and sought out to be mocked and broken. It seems it has become sport to muddy those who believe in a higher standard of morality. Its not discrimination to require others who want to participate in their organization to uphold certain standards. More energy is spent trying to break the BSA because of its standard, than to create your own organization that would serve your standards. It is a guarentee that no matter what I write to defend the honor of the BSA, there will be 10 times the effort to break the BSA. If you the scout or leader cannot stand and recite the scout oath and law and truly try to live your lives by them because you disagree with what you are saying, then find somwhere else to participate that agrees with your beliefs.</p>
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		<title>By: admin</title>
		<link>http://livingwithmormons.com/speaking-of-lds-scouts/comment-page-1/#comment-277</link>
		<dc:creator>admin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Sep 2009 15:17:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://livingwithmormons.com/?p=159#comment-277</guid>
		<description>Hi Scouter,

A quick look at history refutes your argument for the BSA&#039;s &quot;unchanging&quot; values: blacks in America were also &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.aaregistry.com/detail.php?id=2781&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;discriminated (surprise!) by the BSA&lt;/a&gt;.  Not only blacks, but also Hispanic Americans, Native Americans, and other minorities.  Let me remind you also that even religious organizations (read LDS Church) change their &quot;values&quot; over time to accommodate changing cultures.

Not being influenced by &quot;what society is doing&quot; is not only foolish, it&#039;s dangerous.  I for sure would hate to be burned at the stake today for heresy!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Scouter,</p>
<p>A quick look at history refutes your argument for the BSA&#8217;s &#8220;unchanging&#8221; values: blacks in America were also <a href="http://www.aaregistry.com/detail.php?id=2781" rel="nofollow">discriminated (surprise!) by the BSA</a>.  Not only blacks, but also Hispanic Americans, Native Americans, and other minorities.  Let me remind you also that even religious organizations (read LDS Church) change their &#8220;values&#8221; over time to accommodate changing cultures.</p>
<p>Not being influenced by &#8220;what society is doing&#8221; is not only foolish, it&#8217;s dangerous.  I for sure would hate to be burned at the stake today for heresy!!!</p>
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		<title>By: Long time LDS Scouter</title>
		<link>http://livingwithmormons.com/speaking-of-lds-scouts/comment-page-1/#comment-275</link>
		<dc:creator>Long time LDS Scouter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 Sep 2009 15:10:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://livingwithmormons.com/?p=159#comment-275</guid>
		<description>I have to say I dont agree with your post.  However I am impressed with the thought process and respect shown.  I am a scout leader of an LDS sponsored troop in Washington State.  We have almost a 50/50 split of members of the LDS church and those who worship in other faiths.  We have this because of our quality program and respect for others beliefs.  BSA is founded in a strong belief in Diety.  I believe those beliefs are core to its success and why so many sponsoring organizations are churches. 

Many other organizations Boys and Girls clubs, Campfire, School sponsored events offer similar aportunities that BSA offers without the foundation of religion and the standards (sexual preferance) generally associated with it.  One of the points you made as an argument against BSA I feel is one of its strongest and most psoative character points.  That they are not influenced by what society is doing. The values that BSA holds to have been unchanging (for the most part there are some exceptions)since it inception.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to say I dont agree with your post.  However I am impressed with the thought process and respect shown.  I am a scout leader of an LDS sponsored troop in Washington State.  We have almost a 50/50 split of members of the LDS church and those who worship in other faiths.  We have this because of our quality program and respect for others beliefs.  BSA is founded in a strong belief in Diety.  I believe those beliefs are core to its success and why so many sponsoring organizations are churches. </p>
<p>Many other organizations Boys and Girls clubs, Campfire, School sponsored events offer similar aportunities that BSA offers without the foundation of religion and the standards (sexual preferance) generally associated with it.  One of the points you made as an argument against BSA I feel is one of its strongest and most psoative character points.  That they are not influenced by what society is doing. The values that BSA holds to have been unchanging (for the most part there are some exceptions)since it inception.</p>
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		<title>By: admin</title>
		<link>http://livingwithmormons.com/speaking-of-lds-scouts/comment-page-1/#comment-177</link>
		<dc:creator>admin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Jun 2009 20:49:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://livingwithmormons.com/?p=159#comment-177</guid>
		<description>Yay! My first troll!!!

Thanks for stopping by, Activist.

Seeing that you&#039;re clearly obsessed with defending Sarah Palin on your site, I&#039;ll try to use words you can understand in my reply.

While I did acknowledge the good that the Scouting program does (but you probably didn&#039;t read the whole post anyway), I feel that we should always strive to improve on what we&#039;re teaching our children, especially when dealing with archaic, dogmatic views.  Your blog is obviously a good example of intolerance and right-wing psychobabble, so I know it&#039;s hard for you to see that the only reason we&#039;re still holding on to homosexual discrimination is solely religious.
I would agree with you that having more programs that keep kids involved in various activities around the country would only benefit them, but I definitely don&#039;t agree we need to teach them they can&#039;t participate because they choose to love &quot;the wrong gender&quot; based solely on outdated (and arguably incorrect) religious views.

As far as your last assumption, a classic display of what nutbags do, you make a claim of which you know nothing.  You don&#039;t know ANYTHING about me... it&#039;s really amusing you can really write that about someone.  
I think most people would agree that it is those that don&#039;t live amongst diversity who appall it, like you do.  If you have people around you who suffer from discrimination solely for their sexual preference or the color of their skin, you would know and feel the true pain and suffering they go through.  You would understand that people make good choices and people make bad choices and their sexual orientation doesn&#039;t define them in those terms one single bit.

&quot;The Grand Crusade for Diversity, Inc.&quot;?... Rainbow club?... seriously, the hate is strong within you.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yay! My first troll!!!</p>
<p>Thanks for stopping by, Activist.</p>
<p>Seeing that you&#8217;re clearly obsessed with defending Sarah Palin on your site, I&#8217;ll try to use words you can understand in my reply.</p>
<p>While I did acknowledge the good that the Scouting program does (but you probably didn&#8217;t read the whole post anyway), I feel that we should always strive to improve on what we&#8217;re teaching our children, especially when dealing with archaic, dogmatic views.  Your blog is obviously a good example of intolerance and right-wing psychobabble, so I know it&#8217;s hard for you to see that the only reason we&#8217;re still holding on to homosexual discrimination is solely religious.<br />
I would agree with you that having more programs that keep kids involved in various activities around the country would only benefit them, but I definitely don&#8217;t agree we need to teach them they can&#8217;t participate because they choose to love &#8220;the wrong gender&#8221; based solely on outdated (and arguably incorrect) religious views.</p>
<p>As far as your last assumption, a classic display of what nutbags do, you make a claim of which you know nothing.  You don&#8217;t know ANYTHING about me&#8230; it&#8217;s really amusing you can really write that about someone.<br />
I think most people would agree that it is those that don&#8217;t live amongst diversity who appall it, like you do.  If you have people around you who suffer from discrimination solely for their sexual preference or the color of their skin, you would know and feel the true pain and suffering they go through.  You would understand that people make good choices and people make bad choices and their sexual orientation doesn&#8217;t define them in those terms one single bit.</p>
<p>&#8220;The Grand Crusade for Diversity, Inc.&#8221;?&#8230; Rainbow club?&#8230; seriously, the hate is strong within you.</p>
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		<title>By: Anchorage Activist</title>
		<link>http://livingwithmormons.com/speaking-of-lds-scouts/comment-page-1/#comment-176</link>
		<dc:creator>Anchorage Activist</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Jun 2009 16:14:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://livingwithmormons.com/?p=159#comment-176</guid>
		<description>Another typical Scout-bashing article where all the good that Scouts do take a back seat to the Grand Crusade for Diversity, Inc. Maybe if there were more Boy Scout troops in the nation&#039;s ghettoes, you would have fewer black men in jail. Maybe you should concern yourself with that rather than trying to turn every Boy Scout troop into a rainbow club.

People who rhapsodize about diversity, such as yourself, generally have had little experience actually living amongst it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another typical Scout-bashing article where all the good that Scouts do take a back seat to the Grand Crusade for Diversity, Inc. Maybe if there were more Boy Scout troops in the nation&#8217;s ghettoes, you would have fewer black men in jail. Maybe you should concern yourself with that rather than trying to turn every Boy Scout troop into a rainbow club.</p>
<p>People who rhapsodize about diversity, such as yourself, generally have had little experience actually living amongst it.</p>
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		<title>By: Crystal D.</title>
		<link>http://livingwithmormons.com/speaking-of-lds-scouts/comment-page-1/#comment-53</link>
		<dc:creator>Crystal D.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Apr 2009 00:38:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://livingwithmormons.com/?p=159#comment-53</guid>
		<description>Whenever people praise me for being prepared I say &quot;Yep, I&#039;m just like a boy scout, except I embrace and accept all kinds of people.&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Whenever people praise me for being prepared I say &#8220;Yep, I&#8217;m just like a boy scout, except I embrace and accept all kinds of people.&#8221;</p>
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